[cath 55]

Great quizzing , i had to leave early unfortunately, but, its been a real pleasure doing the quizzes this year with people who have remembered its about fun, and thats just what we’ve had that 3 letter word (Fun!) that can be in such short supply !!!

A big thankyou to Aaron, and continuing support from CL and PD …………..and of course a big thank to you to both teams for making the quiz a fun place to be xxx

[cath 55]

Thank you for your input PB , yes, sentencing guidelines does seem a sensible start x

[cath 55]

@forumhostpb wrote:

I totally share the above views. I firmly believe in retribution and not in redemption or reformation.

To the ‘tree huggers’ and ‘social reformers’ I say this. Don’t speak of reforming bad people, they have no inner desire to be reformed. Instead simply treat them like the criminals they are and lock them away from society until they are incapable through age or infirmity of offending.

If that sounds harsh, well it is – but then they made that life choice all by themselves. Always remember that a criminal locked up in prison cannot commit crimes in the free world where we all live.

I think I have briefly covered this one before PB the fact that the criminal who is locked up for abuse on children get free physchiatric care whereas many of there ‘survivors’ in fact have to pay themselves to get good counselling. this is fact, I have been involved with some who simply cannot afford the counselling and the NHS doesnt have the facility to provide it for everyone, thing is an adult who was , in some cases severely abused as a child, does not have the same needs as a child does and of course , quite rightly in some ways the children come first. Human rights? try talking to a room full of those that have been abused, see how much their human rights are taken into account….

However, a person (both men and women) who has been sexually abused as a child carries this with them for the rest of their lives!!

One of the aims of getting people to channel all the disgust and horror at child abuse cases energy into letting the powers that be that we the people wont tolerate it any more, the namby pamby sentencing etc…………in danger of repeating myself…….
We can’t of course save the world, but, i firmly beleive if enough people stand together etc……..

[cath 55]

@minim wrote:

Its a different kettle of fish when it is minors who are the perpetrators. I think we have to deal with that as a different issue. There are lots of youngsters involved in the rape and sexual abuse of other children, but if we get into that we will cloud this issue which is to bring back stiffer sentencing for adults who sexually abuse, torture and murder little ones.

agreed x

[cath 55]

sounds to me like a lot of people have some really good constructive ideas, so, put them all down here and we can collate them, and put together something from them, the main subject is justice for children, , be it abuse /murder etc, its about what WE can do?

[cath 55]

Ok, so if Rubes and mims and anyone else could pm me with suggestions of wordings once the thread has run for a few days, we can then put up a poll, like i said , maybe it wont be untill after the holidays? i have both of your msn addresses too, we could just get into a 3 way conversation to decide the wording of the thread?

So , for the rest of you, what we would like is for you to say what you would like to see happen to child murderers/abusers please stay away from the mob mentality, it has to be realistic, we can then take some of those ideas and word the petition, this is for all those children who are horrifically abused, we cannot save them I know, but we can help to get better justice for them by the punishment fitting the crime maybe?

As Pb said we have to be specific , and know exactly what we want to change. so what do YOU want to change, what sentences would YOU like to see?

[cath 55]

@minim wrote:

I’ll help too

I will get as many friends as possible to add their names. Only thing i’m not sure of is using real names in this environment. What about a facebook instead. We could set up a facebook account maybe, then it will get thousands of people joining.

We just need to make it a strongly and clearly worded petition.

Agreed mims, but, the other point you make no names will be on here?

they will be paper petitions from your own little corner of britain, one person on here maybe who lives in say islington london for instance would take up the one thing we all decide we want changed, physically put together the petition and collect the names from their own locality? then, that person who has pledged to do whatever area they are in, would be responsible for physically sending the petition in for the 1st March?

Each person who agrees to set up a petition will physcially collect their own signatures? that way form each corner of britain a petition will land on the door mat at number 10 at the same time, showing them that whoever has signed it, hopefully there will be a lot, feels strongly about the change

A facebook account is a good idea too, im not sure how u do that, maybe we can liaise at a later date once the wording has been agreed? x

[cath 55]

@forumhostpb wrote:

“Innocent until proven Guilty (beyond all reasonable doubt)” is a fine concept and is one that protects ALL of us against being falsely accused or wrongly convicted.

However, it seems to me that this wonderful concept applies only to the (alleged) perpetrator of a crime. The victim has no protection under law – as the law only comes into effect AFTER a crime has been (allegedly) committed.

I certainly agree with the post on your other thread Cath, that the Human Rights Act ought to be repealed – and the sooner the better.

Ah yes indeed, but, the human rights campaigners will never let it be that these people who commit the most horrific acts on the children of our world get too tough……. we all of course think that they should rot etc, but, its not going to happen, what I am saying I am firmly convinced slowly and surely co-ordinated views of ‘the people’ in this country can bring about change, lets start small, lets feel as though WE are actually doing something?

[cath 55]

@rubyred wrote:

you need at least 2000 signatures for it to be taken seriously..

I pledge you any help.

great rubes!! well going to let this thread ride for a few days, then put togehter anohter thread with clear options? maybe you and I could at this point liaise in pm to put the options together? to be realistic this will probably be now after christmas , so if we both note whats been said and get together on say january 2nd to construct the 2nd thread and go from there?

[cath 55]

Ok PB good advice, so another thread needs to be set up determining this , so will wait and see for a couple of days the comments, then start another thread with clear options. thank you for your input

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