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Racism is the belief that your race is superior to others, and that a race whihc si coming into a country should be ejected and attacked, physically and verbally.
Agreed.
I’m not racist under that definition – quite the opposite. Clear?
That isn’t quite so clear to me. You said people of African decent think differently to white people. Can you explain what you meant if it wasn’t intended to be racist?
You can redefine terms so that theyy cease to make sense – eg Hitler as a centre-left politician
Socialism is left wing
Hitler lead the National Socialist party
What conclusion do you think i’m suppose to make from those two facts?
Anti-Islam isn’t necessarily racist. I’m anti-islam, in that I don’t find Islam at all attractive.
Islam has nothing to do with race.
But as long as they don’t try to convert by breaking the law (eg applying sharia law in full) or by violence (eg radical jihadis) I will fight for their right to practise their own religion in this country.
And what do you want to happen if they do those things?
Nothing?
Fine?
Arrest?
Deport?
Excecute?
I’m relying on drac here
I wouldn’t do that
Any attempt to declare physical war on them by deportation and the consequent use of armed force to overcome resistance smacks of dog whistle racism
Are you saying it is always racist to deport a muslim?
Thats what “Any attempt” means to me.
She takes questions up with an attempt at careful argument (an attempt which doesn’t always succeed, I should say)
I’m just an idiot with a keyboard and an opinion, the same as everyone else here.
That’s why I am so concerned about being called a racist by her. She defines racism in her own way, and according to her definition.
I said I wasn’t sure if you held racist views, some of things you have said I found questionable. But if you are concerned about redefinition of racism, look to the progressives who say racism doesn’t exist against white people because it is ‘prejudice plus power’. Which doesn’t even make sense because there are non-white people who have power, Obama being the obvious example.
She defines racism in her own way, and according to her definition people like Ms K are racists
I don’t think she is racist, athough I don’t understand why she doesn’t think that she is British.
while Tommy Robinson are taken seriously (admittedly she hadn’t heard of Mr Robinson)
I knew who he was, lol. But I never looked into him at all until recently, Lilly Allen threatened to take legal action against him over a Twitter argument, which I wanted to follow as it would have been an interesting ruling.
I don’t think the discussion on British values is exhausted. It’s actually central to the thread – what are Muslims being asked to integrate into? I’ll say more on this.
I would rather have a seperate thread for British values, but maybe that’s just me.
Tommy Robinson is a founder member of the English Defence League, a violent organisation which is racist almost without any dog whistle. To think I’m a racist while taking Tommy Robinson (and Breitbart) seriously shows you are on a very steep learning curve, drac.
I know who he is, and I am no fan of the EDL. An EDL member once said that he hoped a muslim threw me off a rooftop ‘so there is one less gay in the world’. But my main point was about prisons not Tommy Robinson.
What he says about radicalisation in prisons is almost certainly true, and has been noted by other people, and is a real problem in prisons. What he says about getting control of the ciggy trade and using it to force people to convert sounds very suspicious indeed to me, though I’m sure that radical jihadis are not above using tactics like that.
I haven’t been able to find any evidence that either supports or disproves it. There is also the issue as to why salafist imams are being allowed into prisons (if they are).
So you have done some limited research and had it all ready to post. s I knew you would. It is irrelevant anyway.
I was doing the research at the same time as you posted.
When you do some real research, you can ask why young men from the BAME community, including Muslims, are far more likely to be imprisoned for the same crimes as their white peers are NOT imprisoned for.
Prison sentancing needs reform, it allows too much bias into it.
Also women are about half as likely to be sentanced as men, and get about half the time when they do. You should also be concerned about that.
Quoting a convicted criminal the founder of the far right EDL and attempting to pass his views of as factual, sums this thread up.
I never tried to pass it as factual, I said twice in my post that I didn’t know if it was true or not.
Why are you quoting the ignorant racist and anti-Muslim Tommy Robinson, a thief and convicted criminal and attempting to pass his views of as fact?
I don’t think he is racist, he can certainly be an idiot though. But why don’t you try addressing what he said, instead of who he is?
The Ministry Of Justice published these statisitcs in 2014 :
Religion or belief 30 June 2004 30 June 2014 Christian 41,438 42,706 No religion 23,709 25,619 Muslim 6,571 12,106 Buddhist 1,133 1,629 Other religious group 600 1,565 Sikh 498 732 Hindu 342 447 Jewish 181 319 Non-recognised 7 28 Not recorded 9 358 Total 74,488 85,509 So if there are muslim majority prisons, they can’t be very common.
Why are you replying to yourself?
That is the exact response I was expecting, wierdly.
But I am not wannabefatcat, ask Martin to check the IP logs if you don’t believe me.
I’m going to change the subject away from what is and isn’t British values because its not very productive.
I’ve been watching some interviews with Tommy Robbinson recently. I’m going to assume that most people here either don’t know who is he is, or don’t like him. Regardless of that, he has said a few things that I have never heard of before. I still need to do some research to see if there is any truth to his claims but I will summerise them for you.
He says that the disproportionately high population of muslims in prison is a large contributor to radicalisation, where the only contact with the outside a lot of them have is with salafist imams. He also claims that muslims are a majority in most prisons (which I haven’t checked yet), which allows them to control the black market of cigarettes and drugs inside of the prison. Because of this they can force people to either convert to Islam or pay jizya in order to have access to the drugs.
If any of this is true then it seems that the prison system needs to be changed significantly. What do you think about this?
She’s on bully power trip. Such a shame, too, because she’s probably a grown up. Draculina is infinitely better than you so you should show the respect that she deserves.
Thanks, but I can definetly be wrong about things too.
drac, If you think I’m a racist then you’re living in the same upside-down world as BB, where good is bad, right is wrong, Hitler is a centre-left politician. I hate to point out the obvious, but Scots don’t have a different skin-colour, and you’re entering into definite realms of maybe when you say that Scots aren’t separate from England – look at their governmnt
I don’t want to think you are racist Scep, but you said that people think differently based of if they are of African, Indian or White decent. That is racism as far as i’m concerned. I wasn’t talking about your comments on Scottish people, but not all Scots are white either so again you are showing a weird kind of racial bias here.
We are a multi-cultural society. values are not shared between Christians, atheists, Muslims, Jews etc. We are a varied country – we’re not all English in the old sense of the term. We’re British, and we are changing as we’ve always changed in response to other societies.
Multi-culturalism doesn’t work, it never has done. Even Merkel has said this in the past, although why she has failed to act on this on the 7 years since then I don’t know. Society doesn’t function if people don’t share values.
if you think I’m a racist, then you’re in danger of turning the thread into idiot talk – of UKIP extremism where tolerance of different cultures within one country is unacceptable, and your opponents as traitors etc. This is actually NOT British values.
There is a difference between tolerating certain cultural practices, and tolerating their entire culture.
I don’t really believe your statements about Britain always being tolerant. Speaking Welsh used to be punishable by cutting out your tounge. Or something that is within living memory, the castration of gay people. Even people that would otherwise be national heros such as Alan Turing.
I don’t want to go back to those times, but what you are saying about British history is objectively false.
The Russian hackers have stolen your pms.
