13 April, 2022 at 5:59 pm #1144401
So now, lets have a debate about NATO.
‘But, like the UK, we actually fund our responsibilities to NATO, even though it’s a joke’ makes it clear that you’re not exactly a supporter of NATO.
I AM a supporter of NATO and always have been. Of course it comes down to whether one is a pacifist and believe that all humans are peaceful or whether one is a realist and that it takes strength to stand up to the dictators that sadly still rule by fear. The threat of a rogue ruSSian/USSR has always been there since the end of WW2 although the level of the threat has varied. The point is that NATO is an alliance of democracies, well, that was the intention but unfortunately over time, one or two have the members have evolved into more autocratic states but who would want any country to leave NATO the most. pOOtin perhaps?
As to the U.S. involvement, well, your political defence lobby ensures that you spend a shit load of money on weapons and american troops have been stationed in Europe ever since Pearl Harbour the same as many NATO members have their troops in other NATO countries. I believe that over time, some of the NATO members have become somewhat lazy in paying their way but there’s nothing like a local war to wake them up is there puds lad. My my, even Sweden and Finland are racing to get into the club. tRump’s threat to leave NATO would have played right into pOOtin’s plan wouldn’t it. Good job tRump wasn’t around to see that one through. His moaning about other countries spend was just an excuse. tRump wanted out of NATO because pOOtin wanted to destroy NATO. But, pootin’s war has strengthened the alliance, not weakened it which was a massive pootin miscalculation and for an alliance that has ensured no nuclear armageddon for over 70 years, I think they’ve done rather well.
NATO has never been more relevant than it is now and as I’ve said in here many times before, because of the ever increasing divide between east and west.
Just imagine a mother ruSSia from Vladivostok to Lisbon as their media like to portray.
Then it would be china/ruSSIa against the yooo ess ay.
You’d be dust puds lad, fucking radioactive dust.
Concentrate on the global picture puds lad, not your puerile partisan politics. If we in little ol’ UK can do that, then i’m sure the USA can as well.
Still think NATO is a joke?
13 April, 2022 at 6:37 pm #1144403
- This reply was modified 2 months, 2 weeks ago by cooldandywarhol.
Yes, NATO is nothing but a joke. As Russia supplies most NATO countries in Europe with energy, and can instead choose to sell energy to China and their new friend India, NATO in Europe would soon run out of fuel to mobilize their underfunded militaries. Nord Stream 2 was an undeniable blow to the relevancy of NATO.
Only the US, Greece, and the UK currently honor their obligations to fund their militaries with 2% of their GDP. Germany doesn’t even meet 1.5%. Their standing army of 60K will not make a dent in a Russian attack. If NATO members can’t be relied upon to simply fund their militaries, do you really think that they can be relied upon to lay down their lives?
NATO doesn’t protect the US from Russia. Our nuclear arsenal protects us from Russia, as Russia’s nuclear arsenal protects it from the US. Until the USSR collapsed, we operated the Strategic Air Command, which at ALL times, 24/7/365, had nuclear warheads in the air, loaded inn bombers flying around the arctic circle. NATO would be irrelevant in any direct conflict between Russia and the US. Any such conflict today would not be a ground war, it would be a contest of ICBMs. Even though our air force vastly outguns Russia’s air force, air power isn’t relevant either. The vast nuclear arsenals of Russia and the US are what keep us from direct conflict with each other.
So no NATO countries except UK have any relevance in this realm. Can you imagine France launching a nuclear strike on Russia? Even the UK’s involvement would be questionable, given this 2017 headline:
(and yes, I’m aware the your missile was American-made)
British nuke-capable missile flies in wrong direction—toward the United States—in failed test13 April, 2022 at 6:40 pm #1144404
Hungary turn NATO into a joke. There seen as Russia’s stooges within the organization.13 April, 2022 at 7:15 pm #1144405
(Dec 2021) Vladimir Putin has said he will consider a military response if Russia feels threatened by Nato, in a sign that he is not ready to de-escalate tensions over a potential invasion of Ukraine.
So Putin was threatened by a joke ?13 April, 2022 at 7:27 pm #1144406
Oh dear, seems like you’re in the minority……again13 April, 2022 at 7:30 pm #1144407
It’s lonely at the top, believe me. The opinions of morons have never mattered to me, yours included.13 April, 2022 at 7:47 pm #1144408
One other point puds lad, before you go shouting about sizes of nuclear arsenals like many americans are disposed to do.
Do your research on EMP.13 April, 2022 at 7:53 pm #1144409
Do you have a substantive point to make here?13 April, 2022 at 8:50 pm #1144411
I do actually.
You’ve taken this debate into the russia versus america nuclear war domain. EMP first strike followed by the extinction of mankind. End of….so let’s not go there eh.,,,but again, that shows your rather insular view of the world…america first etc etc. You’re a tRumper puds lad, I wouldn’t expect anything less. Are there any tRumpers left…… YES THERE ARE!!!!
You (The US) probably have nuclear missiles pointing at you from ruSSia, china, north korea, maybe soon to be joined by Iran and God’s knows who else…fuck, even the missiles you sell us wanna go home! But, from what I can make out, you’d rather be alone in that little pickle than have alliances with anyone else to TRY to avoid it….even the Paris Accord fighting climate change I guess. Anyway, let’s get back to the point here puds.
pOOtin is a criminal and a thug, retaining autocratic power through fear and corruption. The ultimate 21st century Stalin….but this time with nukes His biggest perceived threat is having democracy and possible nuclear weapons get closer to Moscow. NATO and ruSSia are fighting a proxy war costing the lives of tens of thousands of Ukrainians.
The war is good for the US – all those dead ruSSians, busted T72s, ruski economy trashed without a single american MILITARY life lost. It’s good for NATO because subscriptions and membership will go up without spilling again, a drop of NATO blood. All that american weaponry has come in to NATO bases because they’ve practiced that for decades. Even poor little Romania is a conduit and base for NATO forces and equipment. NATO has responded like most pundits ( including you?) thought they never could. Sure, there are a couple of naughty boys in the room like Turkey and Hungary, but maybe it always takes a challenge to sort out the wheat from the chaff.
NATO is no joke puds lad. It’s real, it’s happening. It’s treading a global security tightrope but it has a rather busy agenda at the moment.
You can go back to your minoritarian heady heights now puds lad. Don’t let the rarefied atmosphere up there cloud your thinking.13 April, 2022 at 9:24 pm #1144412
Your false assumptions come to you from your mental illness:
but again, that shows your rather insular view of the world…america first etc etc
Where did that come from? Nothing I said shows an insular view of the world. I cite facts: NATO is underfunded by countries that have no part to play in a nuclear war.
you’d rather be alone in that little pickle than have alliances with anyone else to TRY to avoid it
Again, where did that come from other than the voices in your head? I’m merely pointing out that NATO is a joke because its members wont meet their obligations, and choose to buy energy from the one country that NATO is supposed to be protecting them FROM.
The war is good for the US – all those dead ruSSians, busted T72s, ruski economy trashed without a single american MILITARY life lost
How is that good for the US? Dead russians are not an asset. Russian soldiers are not a threat to us. We never fight Russia. Busted T72s? How is that relevant to the US? Do you think we fear a ground invasion from Russia?
All that american weaponry has come in to NATO bases because they’ve practiced that for decades
And who pays for it? Consider how much military AID (not sales) we provide overseas. NATO members aren’t paying for much of it. American taxpayers are. Do you think Ukraine (not a NATO country) was paying for missile systems provided to them under Trump as part of military aid packages?
Total US foreign aid to Ukraine in FY 2020 (Trump) was more than double the amount pledged in FY 2015 (Obama). Military aid was the biggest increase — up by $200.7 million — while economic aid increased by $182.9 million, according to United States Agency for International Development and State Department data. Ukraine was the 17th-largest recipient of foreign aid in 2020.
The US pledged $1.8 billion in military aid to Ukraine since 2001— 30.8% of total foreign aid to the country. This is consistent with the international average for US foreign aid with 30% of foreign assistance spent on the military.
Argue facts, Andy. Your opinions are uninformed.
- This reply was modified 2 months, 2 weeks ago by callmepuds.