IVE never lived

I keep changing my mind,its going to be what i think on the day

I’m completely out.

Why?

Principally because I highly value freedom and individual liberty for myself and for others to be able to live how we want to live ; to be able to determine our own futures and govern our own societies that we live in, in whichever way we deem fit for ourselves.

There is absolutely zero chance of this happening at all while we’re apart of the EU.
If we remain we will always just be the slaves to the interests and demands of others—others that we won’t appoint or elect, and who consequentially won’t have our best interests at heart.

To treat otherwise free people of various culturally rich sovereign nations as statistics at best and at burdens at worst—in the way that the globally oriented EU project necessarily does—for me, is completely unacceptable.

So as I hold the pen to mark “leave” in the voting booth, you can be sure that I’ll also be momentarily loosening my grip to extend a one-fingered salute to the EU elites such as this man, the current president of the European Parliament:

sceptical guy wrote:

Sorry, BB, I have news for you while you’re waving the flag.

The flag you’d urinate on no doubt.

sceptical guy wrote:

Britain is still a sovereign country – that’s why we can have a referendum on this. If we make the mistake of voting out, then you and I and the EU will have to accept all the consequences, because the UK is sovereign.

We stop being sovereign when we can’t opt to leave. Manchester cannot vote to leave the UK (without the permission of parliament) because manchester is not sovereign. The UK is.

Quite a strange way to define sovereignty, it’s not how I would define it.

For me sovereignty is the degree to which we control and regulate ourselves in all areas of law and policy that is necessarily free from the control of external authorities.

As we’re already in the EU then we currently aren’t a very sovereign nation as it is (see below), so a vote to remain in the EU is therefore a vote to further suspend and concede more of our sovereignty until we decide that we want to try and get it back again at a later date in the future… but by then of which thousands of new laws and regulations that affect us would have already been passed without our consent since we’d have no way to object to or reject them. The EU’s intention for “greater and closer union” also practically guarantees that we will lose more and more of our independence and powers that we do currently have—including militarily since there’s also apparently a new EU Armed Forces in the works. Essentially we will eventually be nothing but a star in the EU flag; Britain will be no more.

sceptical guy wrote:

If we opt to stay in, which is the sensible decison, then it’s a vote to accept being part of a trading block, which involves accepting the rules and the costs of being part of a club. That is a good deal, as we aren’t in the Euro (unless and until we want to join), refuse to sign the Schengen Agreement on travel, and get the big discount on our contributions to teh EU won by Thatcher in 1984. We do that because we are soveeign

We pay these costs and abide by the rules of a number of organisations – not just the EU. We also accept the costs of being in the UN, in the IMF, the European Court of Human Rights, etc. etc.

There’s a lot of arguments to be had against what you’ve said here, but instead of dragging this out I’ll just quickly summarise to say that neither side can claim to be more sensible than the other, and that it’s purely all down to where people stand in terms of their values and principles. For those that value freedom and individual liberty, democracy, parliamentary accountability, sovereignty, national and cultural identity, and being able to control our own borders, then the most “sensible” thing for them to do would absolutely be to leave now while they can; whereas those who don’t particularly value these things, or who even actively opposes them, would therefore likewise be doing the most “sensible” thing in voting to remain.

One of the biggest points of contention leading up to the referendum is on the amount that the EU does currently control us. There seems to be a lot of people who are confused about this and don’t know how many UK laws are created by our parliament vs those that are imposed upon us by the EU.

Here I think is a helpful and definite answer that’s widely used by independent and impartial fact-checking organisations:

Full report can be read here: https://forbritain.org/percentagelaws.pdf

A mammoth 59.3% of all UK laws are forcefully imposed upon us by the EU.

#Not in my name though
Here’s to hoping more Brits join the side of the ordinary people against the establishment elites, and then vote to leave this corrupt and failing EU so that we ultimately win our country back.

BB wrote:

Oh and here we have one of the highest ranking officials of the EU trying to threaten intimidate and bully anyone who wants to vote to leave:

http://news.sky.com/story/1699424/eu-chief-juncker-warns-uk-over-deserters

It speaks volumes.
How could anyone tolerate this?

We have the 2nd biggest economy in Europe and the 5th biggest economy on the entire planet, with a prosperous looking future. We have to liberate ourselves from the clutches of these power hungry nuts and their anti-democratic superstate and set the precedence for other European nations to follow in our footsteps.

Totally agree and would add that any left leaning person who supports the neo-liberal EU and UK membership of that trade monopoly are in fact total hypocrites. These fake lefties even attempt (poorly) to defend the secretly negotiated TTIP and CEPA, which for all intents and purposes, allows private business to sue in private courts democratically elected governments.