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@tiler wrote:
There are times when you do talk a load of tripe, especially where the real terrorist murderers are concerned, a few get into a compound let of a few rounds, grab a soldier, big deal,
Now the murdereing scum have put the army on full alert, for a wholesale murder program.
I’m beginning to think Iran is right, wipe out this cancer of Zionism.
Well it now seems that I was wrong with the initial comments about this attack. The border attack wasn’t just an off the cuff act by a few ”provoked” Palestinians but it now appears that it was a carefully planned operation.
The armed wing of Hamas – Izzedine Al-Quassam Brigades (Mr B would know quite well who they are) – supported this operation which was actually carried out by The Popular Resistance Committee, a relatively new terrorist grouping.
They carefully planned a strategic attack under the border wall by digging a long tunnel that emerged 300 yards into Israel. A commando group of trained terrorists then burst out heavily armed with grenades and rocket launchers.
They firstly attacked a dug in tank by blowing off the rear doors with a rocket launcher and then throwing grenades inside it, killing two occupants and injuring a third. They captured the injured gunner (a 19 year old Corporal Gilad Shalit) by forcing him out at gunpoint and dragging him back across the border, cutting the border wire to escape.
A separate group attacked a concrete observation tower again with rocket launchers. they tried to storm it but were all killed by the defenders as they climed the stairs inside.
So…. it was a little bit more than “a few get into a compound let of a few rounds, grab a soldier, big deal,” eh Tiler???
Strangely enough, although these groups are all members of Hamas, it was trying to distance itself from the terrorist cross border attack.
I wonder why. Surely they would love to gloat over the dead bodies of a few Jews???
Oh and news just in. It appears that our friendly neighbourhood terrorists – Hamas – have launched an attack on an Israeli border post, killed a couple of soldiers/border guards and taken a third one hostage.
Hamas issued a statement saying that their ”freedom fighters” ( i.e. terrorist murderers)were ‘provoked into it’ by Israel. Oh right… sure they were.
So nobody actually planned this in advance or organised anything – oh no. Just a bunch of poor old Palestinian farmers, whose human rights had been eroded, had a few drinks down the local on Saturday night and thought ”I know, let’s go and shoot up the border post and see how many we can kill or capture”.
So Abdul says “I just happen to have these AH47’s, some grenades and rocket launchers in the back bedroom” and his mate says “Oh and I just happen to have this armoured car in my cowshed”. Right then boys off we go.
What’s the betting that Israel will now retaliate big style and go in and get their hostage back??? They’re not going to be too fussy if they kill a few more terrorists but of course the world’s Press will be invited along afterwards by Hamas to take photos of innocent women and children who will be killed / injured in the attack.
This stuff is all about getting favourable Press coverage for their ”cause” and is a totally cynical exercise in media manipulation. It’s the same futile sort of gesture as Yasser Arafat wearing a shoulder holster at the UN – calculated to attract world media attention.
@drivel wrote:
The fact is the rest of the Arab states don’t really want to integrate the Palestinians – so unless they renounce their terrorist activities it looks like they are stuck
…. and that my friend is the crux of the issue. Hence my comment that they’d do better to make the best of their lot and work towards creating national wealth rather than national killing.
Absolutely right !!! It was nothing more than the normal scene on a Friday or Saturday night in most town centres when the pubs shut.
So the Germans don’t like it when English fans wave blow up Spitfires around and remind them of one or two interesting facts in history – Oh dear! Well they’re not famous for their national sense of humour are they???
A typical night in any UK town centre.
England 1- Germany 0
@chathostuk wrote:
How many England fans do they say are over there? 70,000? 100 get arrested – thats 0.001%.
Er… whilst I don’t want to get done for ”Hassling the Hoff” but 100 in 70,000 is actually 0.14%.
Oh and they’re all nosepickers :lol: :lol: :lol:
awaits electronic P 45
I’m not totally clear where your accusations are going Mr B. In the real world nations pay lip service to so-called international law and so-called human rights when it suits them to do so. And when it doesn’t suit them, they simply press ahead with whatever it is they intend to do anyway….. and there’s not a whole lot anybody is going to do about it.
I hear all the arguments about who was there first etc etc and dismiss them as so much hot air. Every terrorist organisation that ever there was uses historical arguments (or their version of history at any rate) to ”prove” that they are right and the other lot are ”oppressors”.
Every terrorist organisation always bleats on about how their ”human rights” have been violated by somebody or other. Oh and let’s not forget the ”peace activists” – surely a contradiction in terms.
The bottom line is that Israel is there and by the looks of it they are going to stay there. Might is right???? How about ‘might usually wins’ as a more realistic position. I am sure that the Palestinian’s ”brothers” in Jordan. Egypt, Syria etc could, if they wanted to, give Israel a big problem. Strangely enough it suits them to simply let the Palestinians stew in a juice of their own making. Their own ‘brothers’ simply pay lip service to the Palestinian cause and then just carry on regardless. Maybe this tells you something about Arab solidarity – but somehow I doubt it.
Perhaps one day the so-called Palestinian people can put aside their internal squabbles…. Hamas will renounce terrorism ……perhaps they can even agree on a common Government or miracle of miracles they can stop killing each other. Not much chance of that happening this decade, but we can always hope.
If they simply accepted the status quo and got on with looking after their own instead of fighting a futile ”war” they would do a whole lot better for their hungry people who are ”oppressed” by their own ‘freedom fighters’.
@tiler wrote:
All the excuses in the world won’t alter the fact that the Israeli’s are killing and murderering men women and children in a country they are occupying by force, Israel was born in terrorism, ruled by terrorists and is still a terrorist state, it seems the only way to stop it, is to target them as terrorists,
A coalition to invade them and destroy their WMD’s, and kill or arrest the terrorist leaders. and try them as war criminals.
Interesting viewpoint. And who do you suppose is going to have the balls to take on the Israelis???
Yes this is all fascinating Mr B but now let’s try to live in the real world shall we???
@Mr Bigstuff wrote:
Sorry PB but your analysis defies logic. You’re basically saying that international law and human rights don’t matter. If you follow that argument to its logical conclusion then the genocide that Milosevic tried to carry out in Kosovo was ok, Saddam’s invasion of Kuwait was justified and Bin laden’s attack on sept 11 was ok too. You can’t have a world where nobody obeys international law, it would take us back into the dark ages.
Whether they matter or not – and that is still open to debate – the fact is that they are totally ignored by those who want to ignore them. Countries obey international law when it suits them to do so. Terrorist murderers do NOT obey international (or any other) law at all and indeed only cite it or use it as a stick to beat their enemies with.
Terrorists are quick to complain that their so-called Human Rights have been violated whilst at the same time murdering those they oppose. This human rights farce is in reality a smokescreen used to give some sort of justification to acts of murder and terror.
@Mr B wrote:
I just think you people have no idea about the sort of human rights abuses that have been going on there on a daily basis. Palestinians have been tortured, murdered, they’ve had their land forcibly taken from them, they’ve had their homes bulldozed …………………etc etc etc etc ad infinitum
Yeah yeah sure they moan and whinge about THEIR so-called human rights. They are not so vociferous about their human responsibilities though. As for anybody else’s human rights – they don’t seem to have any according to the Palestinian terrorists.
@Mr B wrote:
The wall that the Israelis are building was deemed illegal by the World Court because it’s not built on Israel’s border. It cuts deeply into Palestinian territory and is seen as an attempt to annex Palestinian land. You can’t go around stealing other people’s land …….etc etc etc
Well the wall is there and it looks as though it’s staying there doesn’t it??? The World Court is an utterly toothless tiger, all froth and no substance. Next thing you know they’ll be moaning that the Israelis didn’t have planning permission !!!
It’s a bloody good idea that wall. The Palestinian suicide bombers cannot just enter Israel any more and murder women and children, as they used to do with impunity. So now they moan on and on about their land being taken away. The wall is built where it will have a strategic effect. If the Palestinians don’t like it then maybe they should have packed up murdering the Israelis.
@Mr B wrote:
How can you seriously say that the Palestinians should be satisfied with what they have when what they have keeps being taken from them? When the settlements expand what do you think they build them on? Do you think the settlements are built up in the clouds? Do you think their “security fence” doesn’t need ground to be built on? You don’t build settlements unless your objective is to annex somebody else’s land. You don’t celebrate the capture of jerusalem and call it “the eternal and undivided capital of the Jewish state” if you have any intention of ever giving Palestinians control of East Jerusalem.
Like it or not, Israel builds its settlements and proceeds to cultivate the land and create prosperity from it. The Palestinians are totally involved with constant whingeing about how unfair it is – yet all they seem to focus on is fighting amongst themselves and killing each other, that is when they can’t find any Jews to slaughter.
As i said above, in the absence of any so-called peace, then the wall / ‘security fence’ is a bloody good idea. It keep the two sides apart and prevents any more slaughter.There is no point at all in ”peace talks” – an utter waste of time and no doubt vastly expensive into the bargain. The Palestinians and the Israelis clearly can’t live beside one another in peace and harmony. Fine then the wall will keep them apart and they can all get on with it.
@Mr B wrote:
The bottom line is that the mandate that gives Israel the right to exist gives the palestinians a right to a state on the West bank. If you don’t believe in the mandate then it follows that you don’t believe in Israel’s right to exist because without the mandate there is no right. You can talk till the cows come home about how you think the Israelis are entitled to the golan and the west bank and jerusalem but your opinion isn’t worth sh1t because there is no entitlement to those things. The fact that no country apart from Israel recognizes the occupied territories as being part of Israel proves that your opinions about Israel’s rights to that land are worthless.
Worthless my opinions may be – but they are nevertheless my opinions and i am fully entitled to hold them, even if they do not agree with your own. I have avoided openly insulting you, perhaps you would do me the same courtesy.
Palestinian complaining about ”mandates” , breaches of human rights and so on and so forth is frankly an utter waste if time. The fact is that Israel is there and looks as though it is going to stay there probably for all time.
The best thing that the Palestinians can do for themselves is to stop running off to World Courts and Human Rights activists because we all know that these activities are simply propaganda ploys to get them attention from the world’s Media and to try to justify their murderous activities.
If they disbanded all their numerous groups of so called freedom fighters (terrorist murderers) ans set them to cultivating their land they’d be a lot better off. If they spent less money purchasing arms and spent it instead on paying their civil servants and Police then their ”country” would be able to stabilise and prosper.
Ruby, as others have said more eloquently before me, we are getting utterly bored with ‘Palestinian’ history lessons. OK the history is quite interesting, but we are still awaiting the lesson.
Droning on about the US supporting Israel is simply stating the bleeding obvious. So the Palestinians also have their (Arab) supporters as well. Looks like everybody is fighting this conflict through third parties eh?
Sorry but I really don’t agree with your analysis Mr B. OK I know you are really sympathetic to the Palestinian cause etc etc and they seem to be able to do no wrong – whoever they murder and however many they murder, where they murder them and even how they murder them. OK they whinge on and on about their human rights and how terribly Israel has behaved for the last … (fill in your own number)… years.
Yes, it is fashionable to blame the US for everything so why not jump on that bandwaggon? Hey, all the other Lefties and ”Human Rights” activists are doing it, so why not you?
But you know the bottom line is that the Israelis are tough bastards who don’t give in. Kill one of theirs and they’ll come after you for ever. Shell their country from the Golan Heights and they’ll push you off it and occupy it to stop you – and the hell with International opinion.
So quoting (toothless) UN resolutions is a total waste of time – everybody else in the world ignores them so why not the Israelis? Regurgitating ‘history’ to prove a point is futile. The plain fact is that Israel is there and they are going to fight tooth and nail to the last drop of blood to stay there.
They have built a whopping big wall to keep the terrorist suicide bombers out – fine, let the Palestinians get on with making their bit of country wealthy and concentrate on growing for the future instead of consuming themselves with hatred and bitterness.
It’s time they got over it and moved on.
